Christian and Atheist Discuss the Cause of the Universe and the Easter Bunny

Christian and Atheist discuss the Easter Bunny and the cause of the universe.

A: You xtians are so silly. You believe in a great god in the sky. Us reasonable people do not believe in fantasies like the Easter Bunny.
C: There is no evidence to show the Easter Bunny is real.
A: That’s right. No reasonable person would believe in something without evidence. And your sky god has no evidence either. Therefore we should believe neither. You are a foolish person.
C: The God of the Bible is reasonable and has several lines of evidence to support His existence. One is the Kalam cosmological argument. There is also the vertical cosmological argument, the moral argument, and the argument from design.
A: Silly person, the Kalam argument fails.
C: How so? The Kalam says that everything that has a beginning needs a cause, the universe had a beginning, therefore the universe has a cause.
A: The Kalam fails on the first premise, You haven’t looked at everything that came to existence, so you cannot say that everything requires a cause.
C: Are you seriously saying that there could be something that arises without a cause?
A: I’m saying it’s possible that could happen, and since you have not viewed the beginning of everything, you cannot categorically say that everything needs a cause.
C: Hmm. Didn’t you just say that the Easter Bunny is false?
A: Of course it’s false.
C: How do you know? Have you checked everywhere in the world? Could it not be logically possible that you did not look in the one place that the Easter Bunny existed, and you just missed it?
A: See, now you are being really crazy. It’s obvious to everyone that there’s no Easter Bunny because no one has ever seen one, ever.
C: So if no one ever sees an Easter Bunny, are you saying we can reasonably conclude it has not happened?
A:  Yes, of course.
C: So if no one ever sees a thing arise without a cause, we can reasonably conclude that nothing arises without a cause?
A: Well, uh, no.
C: Why?
A: Well, because it just does not work that way.
C: Why? If it’s true that we can make statements about Easter Bunnies because of universal experience, we should be able to make a conclusion about the cause of all things based on the same universal experience.
A:  But this is absurd. You are a stupid idiot.
C: Further, has not some atheists told us that the universe could have come from nothing, without a cause, because it could have come from the quantum vacuum?
A:  Yes, yes, the quantum vacuum. Now that’s reasonable. It proves that the universe does not need a cause. The Kalam fails again.
C: So the quantum vacuum could have pre-existed the universe?
A: Yes, it could have pre-existed the universe.
C: Pre-“existed,” huh? Sounds like the so-called quantum vacuum is a thing…..a thing with causal power, or at least the potential for the beginning of the universe.  Therefore you are saying it is not nothing. So according to you, the universe had a cause, but did not have a cause. This is not reasonable.
A: Uh……you are a big fat stupid idiot.
C: Yeah, Ok. Let’s try an experiment. I’m going to inject you with truth serum. (gives Atheist a shot). There now. You denied the first premise of the Kalam argument, which says that everything that has a beginning has a cause. To deny this is absurd, and we have no evidence anything ever arose without a cause. Why would you make such an absurd claim?
A: Because I do not want God to exist and I will look for any loophole, no matter how tiny.
C: Yeah, I thought as much. You told me a minute ago that no reasonable person would believe in something without evidence, but then you claimed you believed that something could arise without a cause, even though there is no evidence anything like that ever happened. Can you not see how unreasonable this is?
A: Yes, but if God exists, I’ll have to answer for my personal life.
C: I would suggest you read the Bible and learn of Jesus. He will clean up your personal life.

 

About humblesmith

Christian Apologist & Philosopher
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15 Responses to Christian and Atheist Discuss the Cause of the Universe and the Easter Bunny

  1. John Branyan says:

    The truth serum injection will (and should) outrage atheists. I’ve had heathen suggest that God isn’t all powerful because he can’t overcome their disbelief. If God exists, He would provide such overwhelming evidence that even hardened skeptics would believe. In essence, they are demanding that God chemically alter their will. Program them to be faith machines.

    It is correct that faith always comes down to choice. We choose what we want to believe. Always.

  2. Joseph Waked says:

    I’d love to see some more exchanges with atheist interlocutors. It’s actually helpful for me to hear or see such an exchange so I know how to talk about proofs of God’s existence.

    • humblesmith says:

      I have written a handful of these “Christian and Atheist” dialogues on this blog. Just go to the search box and search for “Christian and Atheist”

      • Joseph Waked says:

        Terrific! Thanks.
        I’m starting to make headway with an atheist relative, who is now more willing to moving our conversation forward after I explained that I view God as the Divine Mind. My relative had not heard that before, partly due to his unconscious attachment to scientism. After a couple of breakthroughs on the existence of immaterials, e.g., ideas, propositions, concepts, transcendentals, etc., he became more receptive.

        However, he soon raised an obstacle. How is it that I can “pray” to this Super Intellect? I told him that we can talk about this the next time we speak. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can logically explain the reasonableness of prayer?

        • humblesmith says:

          If God is divine mind, a mind can understand communication. Seems straightforward.

          • Joseph Waked says:

            Obviously, he still hasn’t wrapped his head around God’s attributes, so he is still viewing this in strictly human terms. That is, your mind and my mind communicate via our senses, organs and bodies. Not through some sort of “telepathy.” Let’s not forget the mockery presented by new atheists, e.g., this mythical man in the sky can somehow hear our inner thoughts.

            As I’m typing this, I realized that the best approach is to walk through the necessary attributes that the Divine Mind must possess, which may then answer this atheist “dilemma” — when compared to creating the entire universe — understanding our thoughts, whether spoken or remaining internal, is relatively “easy.”

  3. john zande says:

    the universe had a beginning

    This is not correct. We know Inflation began. We do not know what was happening before Inflation.

    May I ask you a question, though: Was there ever nothing?

    • humblesmith says:

      Actually, we do know some things about the first cause. Since effects reflect their causes, and follow their causes, then we can determine that the cause of the universe was powerful and personal, since the effect has these things.

      As to nothing, please….not that tired old fallacy. Obviously, there was never a time where absolutely nothing existed, since something now exists, and nothing is has no causal power. Therefore something had to be eternal. It could not be material, since anything material always has a beginning.

      Please do not try to say that we do not know about the beginning, or that since something was eternal, we cannot prove it was God. These are not logical and per my comment policy, will not go round and round with nonsense.

      • john zande says:

        personal

        This particular universe is 13.8 billion years old. The earth is 4.5 billion years old. Life is 3.8 billion years old. The Human line began 7 million years ago with Sahelanthropus tchadensis. Human beings are ~200,000 years old. For more or less 170,000 of those 200,000 years human beings were primarily prey animals.

        My apologies, but I fail to see how this is ‘personal’

        Obviously, there was never a time where absolutely nothing existed

        So there was never nothing. I agree. There has always been something. I would agree.

        It could not be material, since anything material always has a beginning.

        Do you know how super high energy strings behave in a 6-dimensional Calabi–Yau manifold? I don’t, and I’m not afraid to say so. Presently, we’re observing this world from the perspective of (flawed) Newtonian physics, and that models the baryonic world, which comprises a grand total of just 4.6% of this particular universe, interacting with just 3 of anywhere from 11 to 26 dimensions.

        Given that your statement is based on just 4.6% of this universe, it would appear that your statement is not fully thought-through, or supported by the arrogance in which it was presented.

        Please do not try to say that we do not know about the beginning, or that since something was eternal, we cannot prove it was God.

        Well, as we have absolutely no idea whatsoever as to what was happening before Inflation, it would be the height of irrationality to speak of ‘beginnings’ and expect to be taken seriously.

        The point, though, has already been made. There was never nothing. There was always something. The theistic question—Why is there something rather than nothing—is thoroughly meaningless.

        • humblesmith says:

          There is no evidence that anything ever arose without a cause.
          There is plenty of evidence that anything that has a beginning has a cause, which aligns with all we have ever observed.
          A wise person would align with all present evidence rather than hope for speculations about unproven things.
          We know that inflation was caused, and whatever the cause it ultimately leads to a first, uncaused cause. This first cause has the capability to cause all that is, including personality. The length of time to do so does not reduce the necessity of the cause.
          By looking at the effect, we can indeed derive some things about the cause, but not all, Romans 1:20 tells us this, and it aligns with what we observe.

          But you are entitled to your opinion.

          • john zande says:

            There is no evidence that anything ever arose without a cause.

            By your own earlier statement, this is false. You concede there was never nothing. There was always something.

            We have evidence the universe exists, therefore it is only reasonable, logical, and rational to assume the universe contains the reasons and mechanisms for its own existence. That is to say, the universe is aseitic.

          • John Branyan says:

            Congrats, JZ.
            You have successfully vanquished another straw man!

    • humblesmith says:

      Everything finite has a beginning. Everything material is finite and has a beginning. God is not material nor finite. The argument we give says that every effect has a cause, and everything with a beginning has a cause.

  4. John Branyan says:

    “We do not know what was happening before Inflation.”
    “Was there ever nothing?”

    Brilliant!
    You answered your own question before you asked it!

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